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Watsine
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PostSubject: Noble Wars   Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:32 pm

So having been working on 1.31 I got stuck trying to figure out why the king would give land to nobles and what the system for giving land should be like. I then had the idea of instead of having the king give the land, nobles who have the highest reputation would instead get the best/most land. So here have been my though on how reputation would be dealt with.

Things that increase fame:
High wealth
battle - helping face events (peasants can get fame by doing this)
donate - Donate to the church for some rep (peasants can get VERY minor fame from this)
Killing Bandits (peasants can get very minor fame from this)

Things that decrease fame:
town is unhappy - makes everyone in power look bad, peasants not affected.
ignore event - cowards are not looked well upon
pay someone to spread rumors
jailed - villains are not looked well upon - rep not hurt as much if it is directly to jail or by king vote
Don't pay taxes/don't have enough
Murder a citizen with you own hands
Get caught stealing


I'll also be adding it so that if the king auto-jails, or jails by his vote, then the town becomes unhappy

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Last edited by Diaster on Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:44 pm; edited 7 times in total
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Vila33
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:42 pm

Great! Smile
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Watsine
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:49 pm

if you can think of any other ways to get rep/lose rep please feel free to add on.

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Alabs
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Sat Oct 15, 2011 7:43 pm

minus to rep
accidentally kill a villager
hit a good lord's troops
rob the weapon shop
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IknowInoob
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:46 pm

Joining the evil side of some events?
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YakaryBovine
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Sat Oct 22, 2011 10:40 pm

Haven't posted in here in a while but I found this idea really exciting. : ) Idea's cool, but here's my opinion:

For your increases:

High Wealth is a bad idea because players are going to do this regardless of the bonus. Not a true challenge.
Donating is definitely cool because there's no other tangible bonus for doing it. Even better, the donations increase happiness of the city. Perfect.
Killing bandits is similar to High Wealth. Nobody benefits from the bandits being dead except you. On the other hand, maybe it could apply only if your soldiers kill the bandits and maybe it could apply to any unit on or near a road. This would be like the noble keeping the roads safe for citizens. This might be too much work, though.
Everything else is just dandy.

For your decreases:

Paying for rumours is really cool.
Everything else is just dandy.

Something that could make this really perfect, though, is allowing other players to have an input on a Noble's reputation. Say I kind of liked Lord Chief-Oblivion because he was keeping the roads clear, I could offer my 'support' via a command which could increase his reputation until I withdraw my support. This might be too complicated for your typical Fantasy Life player, but I'd really like it. : )

Edit: Oh, I forgot to mention. The reason for the above is because it would allow a Noble to tangibly help people and still be rewarded for it. I guess that might have been obvious.
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Watsine
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Sun Oct 23, 2011 11:56 am

Well I was chatting with some buddies and they gave me the idea to have a limited pool of fame. Where if once the pool was empty, you wouldn't get anything or your would take fame from the other nobles. Things that reduce your fame would simply go to the pool and put it up for grabs. This way it is a constant fight with the others for fame.

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YakaryBovine
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Sun Oct 23, 2011 11:38 pm

That's pretty damn cool. One thing I think is a really bad idea, though, is involving hero vs. hero combat in this. Nobles shouldn't be able to take out other nobles simply because they grinded more. It should, in my opinion, be a more strategic sort of gameplay. Maybe one could lose fame by directly killing other Nobles?

Of course, that wouldn't stop anybody from hiring assassins. Which is cool.
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Watsine
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Mon Oct 24, 2011 12:23 am

O, yes I did have it where direct combat against another noble makes you lose fame. Guess I forgot to throw it up. Although I'm considering allowing duels to be done where you can fight in the arena.

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Vila33
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:22 am

Yea, that would really help. PVP is banned by the king in most games, and there are always guys that steal the dead guy's gold.
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Sawyer_taco
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Thu Oct 27, 2011 4:03 am

what if you exhibited artifacts to gain fame but while gaining it for you there is the risk they get stolen by dirty peasant scum. and a stolen artifact could be a HOT PROPERTY item for a while if you don't bribe someone and they would be unable to just go instantly back on exhibit due to that
however I have reservations as to the fact of it being fame rather than honor if it's for a noble? the above would be obviously fame but the rest of the things would be more honor or a mix of both
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Watsine
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Thu Oct 27, 2011 10:41 am

Sawyer_taco wrote:
what if you exhibited artifacts to gain fame but while gaining it for you there is the risk they get stolen by dirty peasant scum. and a stolen artifact could be a HOT PROPERTY item for a while if you don't bribe someone and they would be unable to just go instantly back on exhibit due to that
however I have reservations as to the fact of it being fame rather than honor if it's for a noble? the above would be obviously fame but the rest of the things would be more honor or a mix of both
Displays of wealth and power for fame? I like it. I intend on adding a building where nobles can go to mingle and where they will get their special items, mercs, and what not. I'll make the displays there and make it possible to sneak in and steal from it.

Also its fame over honor because honor indicates a lack of back-stabbing. I like back-stabbing in my games.

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Sawyer_taco
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Thu Oct 27, 2011 3:06 pm

well see the honor could be the public view so if you just assassinate someone and don't get caught, nothing to your honor but if you just fucked someone up in the middle of the street it'd be kinda famous bu not very honorable evidently
in this kinda shit there'd probably have to be abfame scale as well as an honor scale and dual scales can be anal
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Mr.Snake
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:29 pm

It is possible if the king someone separates from kingdom, at murder of units of this player and the player it receives nobleness. And possibility to separate the player from kingdom is possible only at very small indicators of its nobleness. As the king or strongly noble players can suit similarity of points which will give nobleness to all come under the invitation. But if you come without the invitation that nobleness decreases. These balls would bear normal expenses for this purpose who them organized but thus would give it a nobleness considerable quantity (or for example the has more come people the will give nobleness to that who more has begun ball. Thus the owner of ball spent money for special things for example for music, on house registrations in which will pass ball. And the better and more expensively expenses of the owner the will be received nobleness by the come players more. Then come it is more and the owner will receive even more nobleness). Even to balls it would be possible to add possibility to become the king and \or the queen of ball and then this player will receive more nobleness and probably small monetary compensation. It not only has given the chance receptions of nobleness but also would give большее values to purchase of houses as ball could be begun only in the house and the house price too would influence received nobleness participating in ball. 3 way of an increase of nobleness consists in that that the king has in the lock a place similar to arena. There where now there is a lattice for reception of level by the king. It is possible to put there NPC and the king at desire could declare tournament on which players with particularly specified quantity of nobleness could participate. The cage thus would disappear and at first two entered players got up on a circle the arena was closed and there was a duel 1х1. The won player will receive quantity of nobleness which the king before tournament opening (this nobleness would be minimum for participation in tournament) has established and lost lost it. Tournament would terminate or at what expiration or time or after ten fights. Thus certainly there would be a problem with arena expansion. Places certainly a little but I think it it would be interesting enough.
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Watsine
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Mon Nov 21, 2011 3:07 pm

So from what i can read you want to give nobles the ability to hold parties for fame and duels.

The parties thing is interesting I'll admit. When I get the system up and running I'll consider it for a later addition.

Duels have been discussed.

Also can you not just put everything into a wall of text? it makes it very hard to read on top of your broken English. When you are making different points or talking about different things just start a new line like I do.

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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Mon Feb 06, 2012 6:27 pm

So updating this, I've decided peasants will be able to gain honor through acts of heroism. As such, if peasants get some fame, nobles will either have to undercut them or fight even more amongst themselves to gain more power. The perks nobles have will be located in an exclusive building that only those with a certain amount of fame will have access. This I think will allow things to be more competitive.

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RPGOD
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Mon Feb 06, 2012 7:15 pm

what if king dies *leaves*? should there be a war for the throne?
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:12 pm

I'll leave that to its own devices for now. If it seems like it needs an update or system, I'll do it when that bridge comes. For now I just want to get this thing out the door considering how long its been.

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seernox
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:55 am

umm... cool but im thinking of all the possible bugs that might happen... anyway i got some idea's i wanna throw into the mix

- noble shop has security (because FFS i want shop security and that would be a good place to start) + a peasant with good fame can also access the shop

- what if there is a rusher who say... does all the events and doesn't let anybody else help

- make it so that you can start a peasant become famous and become a noble (thats what happened in the olden days anyway)

- give some bonuses for negetive fame (eg. a shop in the rogues den you can only access with negetive fame... it would have gold sink items that are evil orientated like book of necromancy allowing you to summon an undead army or something) + (you can only access the shop with a low fame)

- give the king the power to ally nobles or unallying them (not with the command but politically) and this will raise there fame or lower it depending on the allignment of the king (town happiness + a noble has to allow the political ally and they can unally at any stage) + this would have advantages for the king aswell

- if your going to have more people who have big houses maybe there will have to be another mansion or something


-if you get attacked and have a high fame + a citizen is around they will attack the attacker

+ there should be some kind of thing for negetive fame like getting attacked by citizens randomly or ... i dunno

++ the king should have fame and if they decide to be an evil tyrant king that bandit event doesn't constantly spam but randomly other events that can happen occur instead like a militia attacking

^thats all i can think of at the moment most of it is crap but they are idea's and that is what counts
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Tue Feb 07, 2012 4:26 pm

Yes the noble shop will have security in the form off if you don't have the required fame, you get teleported out like the mine has set up.

The game is going to have a completely new balance, so things like rushing could be nerfed greatly, or empowered. I won't know until the version is done and testing has been done. In the mean time, all I can say is that rp'er will be able to get exp by rp'in so they should be able to keep up with rushers, if they are good.

Peasants will be allowed the chance to access some of the noble benefits, but I'm not going to grant them full access to all the noble benefits. It devalues the noble class if someone can do 2 events and get all their stuff + a bunch of stat buffs.

A negative fame shop at the moment isn't going to happen, but its possible for future additions.

I like the idea of tying fame into the town happiness. I could make it so if the town is unhappy, then the nobles will slowly lose fame.

Mostly I'm starting to think I want to leave the kings out of control of the system. I like the idea of the kings actions reflecting on the nobles indirectly, but direct control is a bit much in my opinion. Also the kings fame is more or less the town's happiness. I'll consider making the bandit event harder to trigger, or make it so an action much be done in addition to a low happiness to trigger it.

Edit: I've also decided to add clergy to the group, so they will also be able to get access to things nobles can, since in those times they were akin to nobles.

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seernox
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Wed Feb 08, 2012 1:47 am

social classes will make the game loads different that's for sure ...

what I meant by the king thing is that the king can give a SLIGHT increase or decrease to fame for a noble... and there really has to be an opposite to all the stuff like having a noble with negative fame gives him bonuses too but they are not as good as the bonuses for positive fame..
here are a couple of other idea's i was thinking of

- merchant ships which the noble can use to increase his money.. they would cost a deal and have a chance to be destroyed by pirates (therefore you need to build ships to protect them aswell) i think that the player has no control over them but they can see them going in and out of the place they go to

- anti assasination device at noble shop ( basically a faery fire ability which makes it so you can still attack and has a long cooldown but it will stop the first attack of enemies giving someone time to react )

- some ways of making money still available.. and some of these should be available to peasants aswell but with only 1-2 noble exclusive ways of making money

ps. when you are doing beta testing i would like to get involved as well, but that is your choice
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Wed Feb 08, 2012 12:26 pm

Having there be no benefit for having low fame is the point in some regard. Why fight to have more fame then another noble if there is no reward for doing it? Anyways, I'm not too keen on most those suggestions, outside maybe having some dark faction that if your exposed to have a link to, you lose massive amounts of fame, and risk jail time.

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RPGOD
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Wed Feb 08, 2012 6:16 pm

remember that there is only twelve players. i imagine only 2 should be nobles?
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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Wed Feb 08, 2012 10:00 pm

Well I was actually thinking 3-4 might go noble, since most people don't want to go peasant, but it will be a wait and see sorta thing. If i have to pull out more restrictions like, only let the 2 most famous people in I will.

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PostSubject: Re: Noble Wars   Sat Feb 11, 2012 12:22 am

as far as i see it fame should be split into 3 categories

Good, Neutral, Evil
Good - focused on defensive and healing
Neutral - focused on mp + hp
Evil - focused on ...... (really couldn't think of anything)

the classes are also split up into the 3 groups evenly ( however not neccesarily )
thief - evil
black mage - evil
slayer - neutral
hunter - neutral
white mage - good
red mage - neutral
warrior - good
cultist - evil
monk - neutral
^ thats 3 evil 2 good and 4 neutral which... is more in favour of evil
(and i will also do the new class system)

Black Mage - evil
Summoner - neutral ( or evil i dont know )
Red Mage - neutral
Monk - neutral
White Mage -good
Paladin -good
Knight - good
Sniper - neutral
Ninja - neutral ( evil )
Rogue - evil
Necromancer - evil
Death Knight - evil
Dragoon -neutral
Beast Master - neutral
^this is 4 evils, 3 goods, and 7 neutrals

i hope i have proved my point in this... there is a distinct favour of evil in the class sets, but to only give good a special shop with good gear is just not balanced that is why I'm saying make an evil shop (which sells gear that is not as good as the good shop but can help with evil rp's) and maybe a neutral shop because there are more neutrals...


also... nobody should start off noble it should be an option.. maybe make it that when you become a noble you get a negative stat bonus / hp or mp and when you aren't a noble you get those stats and/or hp or mp back

^ i hope this made sense and remember it is just an idea and i am hoping that it promotes some discussion because discussion is fun Smile
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